I've been having a frustrating experience with the Pickit 3=20 (intermittent and finnicky connection and programming issues for some=20 devices) which I've googled, but have not been able to resolve after=20 much tinkering with drivers, resistors, and registry settings. A brand=20 new second Pickit 3 gives me the same issues, and so does a new device=20 on a new PCB. So it's time to move on. I really miss using the Pickit 2's, but they don't support the newer=20 devices. Is there anything similar is size/cost that can program the newer=20 devices that any of you would recommend? FWIW, I have not faith in the=20 Pickit 4. Cheers, -Neil. --=20 http://www.piclist.com/techref/piclist PIC/SX FAQ & list archive View/change your membership options at http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist .