Debugging without an ICD is like walking round a strange house at night without lights. You can feel your way cautiously but will trip up eventually The main hardware overhead for using ICD is that you need to reserve two pins for the debugger. The same number of pins that you need for a "couple of status LEDS". And if you want to have the option to reprogram in circuit you have to reserve those same two pins. Often, with a couple of links, you can use those pins for less demanding I/O. Apart from reserving a few RAM locations there doesn't seem to be any software overhead. I have written some very finely timed IO and have had no difficulty tuning it to an instruction cycle. On 18 August 2014 08:23, Jesse Lackey wrote: > Hi - I consider the ICD3 indispensable. LEDs and serial output ("printf > debugging") methods work but is definitely a building a house with only > hand tools approach. IMHO... > > Look at it this way, you can always use an ICD3 and still LED/printf > debug. :) > > J > > Neil wrote: > > Getting back into some PIC dev lately, I and I can't read-back 18F46K22 > > code with my trusty old Pickit 2. The Pickit 3 standalone app is an > > apparently abandoned joke. The MPLAB X IPE does not work either (not > > connecting). And yes I fully erased the chip and reprogrammed it with > > all protection fuses off. I'm thinking it's time to some updated tools > > anyway. > > > > I've traditionally not been big on debuggers/ICE's, as it seemed to > > required hardware and some software changes to account for the > > debugging, so I've generally preferred to build in a serial output for > > an LCD or even just a couple status LEDs, and the Saleae logic I got > > some years has been indispensible. Also, some developers that have don= e > > coding for me also don't bother with ICD's. But it's time I revisit > this. > > > > Are any of you really using an ICD to its full intent and can say that > > it's useful? Do I really need to change much of my circuit/code to use > > an ICD? An ICD3 is only a couple hundred bucks... are there any better > > options for a bit more? FWIW, my applications usually have a lot of > > external analog sensing and very finely timed digital interfacing, some > > with non-standard protocols. Will I be unable to properly debug any of > > this with an ICD? > > > > Cheers, > > -Neil. > > > -- > http://www.piclist.com/techref/piclist PIC/SX FAQ & list archive > View/change your membership options at > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist > --=20 __________________________________________ David C Brown 43 Bings Road Whaley Bridge High Peak Phone: 01663 733236 Derbyshire eMail: dcb.home@gmail.com SK23 7ND web: www.bings-knowle.co.uk/dcb --=20 http://www.piclist.com/techref/piclist PIC/SX FAQ & list archive View/change your membership options at http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist .