> Now with mp3's etc there would not be any desire to build such > a mechanically based beast. Quite so OTT perhaps but maybe I need to ask a few kids personally about what needs or ideas they have Disappointingly, electronics in the NZ secondary curriculum is, to be charitable, minimal. I don't think many of the teachers have much of a clue either. I've seen some woeful answers to questions, even at the entry level, such as what value you use with an LED. The answer given was "47 ohms". Hopelessly incorrect for the question asked, the only qualification given was that "some guy on a forum said it worked OK" I wonder how many LEDs some guy on a forum has gone through Joe --=20 http://www.piclist.com/techref/piclist PIC/SX FAQ & list archive View/change your membership options at http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist .