Agh / Wow. Good stuff, but also rather scary.

Lyle:

> It is interesting to hear other perspectives on the subject. If I find so=
mething
> completely offensive, I'll just "unsubscribble".

That's pretty stunning stuff and sad to hear. The factory workers that
I encountered "only" had to work 365 hours x 10 hours/day. To hear
that in the US some experience even more onerous hours than that is
really stunning. Also inexcusable - but I'll not follow that line
here.

I'd very much hope that there was nothing that was going to be said on
a thread like this that would cause somebody to unsubscribble rather
than to comment AND that any offence that did occur would be something
that would be seen as a result of misunderstanding between the writer
and reader on what was said rather than a substantive difference.

I don't always agree with Bob (as may have been noticed occasionally)
but he is wiser than I am in some areas sometimes [tm] :-).
In this case he had reservations about this thread, as I knew he
would, and in part I imagine he is demonstrating how good my judgement
is/was in promoting it. Fair enough. If it seemed like it would do
damage as severe as to disenfranchise a long time list member over
peoples' musings I'd be pretty sad at my choices, at a minimum. Better
not to be continued than to risk such.

I reread John's comments. They feel like an empathetic attempt to
describe what he sees as reality. I'd expect that he and Lyle would
generally agree with what the other said on the subject - just both
have had different experiences. The reality he sees sounds fairly
real, even though I've been blessed not to have had too much personal
experience of the bad end (nor the extreme "good"). He notes that the
relatively positive life he has encountered personally  has been
"through no fault of his own". ie some draw short straw [RM: although
[dangerously opinionated statement follows] some who do well do not
realise how much of their more favoured experiences of life are not
due to their own  abilities]

I saw this thread as being about manufacturing options and what might
be able to be done to address current imbalances. The material that
John and Lyle wrote is pretty relevant and tied into that, but not
what I really had in mind. Hard to know how to strike a balance and
where a wise edge is to such things. Bob's a smart guy sometimes. [I
thought about putting a comma in there and decided against it :-) ].
Let's see if we can go somewhere positive from here and maybe keep
somewhat closer to the manufacturing / buying / pricing/
overseas/onshore manufacture area. [As above - input so far is both
positive and relevant but 'dangerous'].

Thanks John & Lyle. Good stuff, no matter how disturbing. How do you
get worms back into their can, and how do you get the lid back on?


       Russell
--=20
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