Have you looked at Microchip's "Microstick"? http://www.microchip.com/stellent/idcplg?IdcService=3DSS_GET_PAGE&nodeId=3D= 1406&dDocName=3Den556208 for $35 you get a programmer and 4 different PICs. OK, it has a limited set of targets, but depending on what you want to do it might be a pretty painless way to get going. --McD --=20 http://www.piclist.com PIC/SX FAQ & list archive View/change your membership options at http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist .