On 26/07/2011 00:39, IVP wrote:
>> In practice you have to compete with all other subjects, so you
>> >  will get less time for your class than you think is optimal
> That's fair enough and I can appreciate that
>
> My reasoning was one step past the classroom - the real-world
> applications your students are likely to want to use PICs for
>

I think the purpose of the course is Assembler, rather than training=20
people in the best PIC. Most people are better to use HLL than=20
assembler, ever. But everyone learning electronics and programming=20
should learn assembler and do one Assembler project, even if they never=20
intend to do Assembler or PIC again.

The local Uni uses a Flash based 8051 with a boot loader for Assembler=20
course.

I've encountered/programmed in 8051, Z80, 8086, NEC 78HC11, SC/MP, RCA=20
CDP1802 (it's used in Racal/Grinel Frequency hopping security, early=20
spread spectrum SSB radio). Oddly I quite liked the 78HC11 with its=20
tests that only skipped or not the next instruction. Back in 1984 I=20
wrote a Forth like environment in assembler for it. I didn't at all like=20
the 8051 compared to Z80 back then and the chip count saving on the=20
projects we were doing was minimal.

Back in the day a lot of these things didn't have decent HLL. On PIC I=20
did 3 or 4 assembler projects before switching to C, then JALv2.

I think everyone should learn "an" Assembler as part of the learning=20
process. Knuth even had a fake simulated one on the timeshared mainframe=20
for his students. (ref "Fundamental Algorithms" subtitled "The Art of=20
Computer Programming" 2nd Edition 1973). So choice of Assembler &=20
PIC16F887 isn't about suitability for industrial projects, it's part of=20
an educational strategy.

Similarly only using one Vendor of cpus is a bit strange. IMO the=20
10F/12F/16F/18F are "PIC"s and can be chosen on basis of package, I/O,=20
speed, RAM, Flash and USB from Microchip's selector.  For a project=20
needing more "power" I prefer to select the appropriate x86, ARM, MIPS=20
SoC and suitable Off the shelf OS. Then a much wider range of tools,=20
libraries etc are available.

You *CAN* use an 18F with a Colour LCD touch screen, Ethernet, USB, HDD,=20
SD card reader etc. But is it a sensible starting point because you have=20
used 16F and 18F PICs up till now? There are all the higher end=20
Microchip CPUs with libraries for these things too. But choosing any of=20
them just because of 10F/12F/16F/18F familiarity isn't logical. You need=20
to look at Atom, Geode, Broadcom MIPs, Thomson STseries, Samsung ARM and=20
Texas ARM families. Maybe even Sharc and Blackfin from AMD. You need to=20
look at regular and real time linux, QNX and other specialist OS, rather=20
than a compromise OS shoehorned  onto an 18F.  Choice depends on=20
Application area and if mains or battery and how important User=20
applications are vs an appliance. Even set-boxes and TVs now there may=20
be need to run HbbTV, Java, MHEG5  user or OTA installed aplications=20
etc., not just the "factory" installed features.








--=20
http://www.piclist.com PIC/SX FAQ & list archive
View/change your membership options at
http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist
.