Olin, First, let me say I am not upset about what you said or did, or even that you defined your criteria. =20 I was just pointing out that if a poster is having trouble expressing his (or her) question or point, it would be a good humanitarian gesture to help that person out. I agree with what you say in that you are patronizing the PICLIST because you want to, and it is your=20 free time to do with as you wish. I 100% agree with that. I also agree that attention to detail is=20 important. You are right, or at least I agree with you in saying=20 detail is what seperates the good engineer from the not so good. Of course, this philosophy could be extended to virtually any profession. =20 On ocassion, I give my two cents worth to a poster. I believe I generally give correct answers. On ocassion, I miss the mark. I'm not infallible by any stretch of the term. You have dinged me on some of my answers. I thank you for it as it will hopefully prevent me from making the same mistake again. But if I have a reasonable response for a persons question, I will answer, regardless of how they write the question. =20 I agree that the way some non English speakers compose a question or comment does make for painful reading, if you can read it at all. But, I'm not going to blast them on the air (so to speak) because (1) I believe=20 that isn't necessary, and (2), will just get you resentment from most people. It's better you=20 either correspond directly with them and tactfully give your critism, or just leave the criticism alone altogether. =20 The bottom line from my perspective is you have the right to spend your free time as you wish. You also have the right to give or deny help to anyone you choose. And you have the right to judge ones character=20 or technical competence using your chosen metrics. =20 I don't know for sure how many members the PICLIST has, but let's say there are 200, and each member has about 20 years of experience. That's about 4000 man-years of knowledge to draw from. With so much to offer, it seems it would behoove all of us on the PICLIST to be as helpful and supporting as possible to any poster, regardless of how painful that may or may not be. I try to be that way. I may or may not know if=20 I have succeeded, but at least I know I tried to give the benefit of my knowledge or opinions.=20 =20 Regards, Jim > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: Re: [OT] Choosing what to reply to > From: "Olin Lathrop" > Date: Thu, May 26, 2011 12:46 pm > To: "Microcontroller discussion list - Public." >=20 >=20 > jim@jpes.com wrote: > > I just believe that with the knowledge you have, if someone is really > > "clueless", and you > > want to improve the PICLIST community, you'd want to spend the time > > to educate that person. >=20 > It seems I'm dammed if I do and dammed if I don't. Silently ignoring par= ts > of a post that I didn't have the time/inclination/energy to reply to does= n't > work for Russell. Explaining my internal thought process about what goes > into deciding what I reply to and how much effort I put into it doesn't s= it > well with Bob. >=20 > I suppose "clueless" wasn't a very precise term in that context. I wasn'= t > talking about cluelessness of the technical content but rather about > interacting with a group of volunteers you expect a free favor from. >=20 > More accurately, what I am looking for is attention to detail. In my > experience, this is a common trait among all truly good engineers. I don= 't > believe that this is something one can change or learn. Not everyone can= be > helped or will learn a particular topic. I personally chose to spend mor= e > effort where I think it may be more useful. My own level of hassle in > dealing with the OP also matters a lot, since I'm doing this for free and > therefore have no obligation to do it at all. >=20 > In *my* estimation, those that don't pay attention to detail will not bec= ome > good engineers, and therefore are more of a waste of time to help. I may= be > wrong, and that may be harsh, but I'm not going to apologize for how I ch= ose > to spend my free time. It's my call to make, right or wrong, and whether > anyone else likes it or thinks its fair or not. Furthermore, I have no > obligation to explain my criteria, as even Russell acknoledged. I only d= id > so because Russell put me in a position where not explaining would have l= eft > people with the wrong impression. >=20 > Everyone filters what to reply to and how much all the time. The only > difference is I've given you a look at some of my criteria. Nobody has a= ny > right to be upset at them, in part because nobody had any right to know t= hem > in the first place. I understand some may feel insulted when I explain w= hy > I did or didn't do something in a particular case. However, they have no > right to get upset about internal thoughts. They were always there, just= as > they are with others, the only difference is you now know something about > them. >=20 > Yes, I have my own mental idiot list for the PIClist, just like I have a > mental list of "good" people, and I suspect just like most other members > have too. Some people can be counted on to say dumb things regularly, or > have shown in the past they don't get it too often, or are clearly just n= ot > that bright. Others generally say things you can count on being correct, > some with easily read styles, some with annoying styles. Just like with = any > group of people you know, you form opinions about their abilities and > personalities. >=20 > However, back to the point. Attention to detail is totally different fro= m > knowledge. The less someone takes care in writing a question, the less t= hey > are worth helping. This has nothing to do with what is being asked about= .. > This does include how well english is used. In part that effects the has= sle > level of reading the post. Poor english is just annoying to read. Howev= er, > non-native speakers get a pass on a lot of that stuff since it's a issue = of > ability as apposed to laziness. That distinction is very important. Eve= n > then though, there is no excuse for not following a few simple rules of t= he > language. This includes starting sentences with capital letters and endi= ng > them with periods (or question marks, foreign speakers should just stay a= way > from exlamations). Only Jinx can get away with leaving the period off th= e > last sentence of a paragraph ;-) >=20 > Sometimes, whether known foreigner or not, I may decide I just don't want= to > deal with the poor english. No, it's not fair. It's not the OP's fault = nor > could he have done anything to fix it. Sometimes annoying is still annoy= ing > and that wins out. It's my free time. This is the way the world works > every day. Don't get upset just because somebody points it out. >=20 >=20 > ******************************************************************** > Embed Inc, Littleton Massachusetts, http://www.embedinc.com/products > (978) 742-9014. Gold level PIC consultants since 2000. > --=20 > http://www.piclist.com PIC/SX FAQ & list archive > View/change your membership options at > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist --=20 http://www.piclist.com PIC/SX FAQ & list archive View/change your membership options at http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist .