I've been on this list forever, as a lurker. I've long since gotten a job
that gives me no time to dabble in PIC chips, but I still like to keep up
with things, so I keep reading most of the messages on this list.

I have observed the ongoing relationship between Olin and others on this
list. It is an interesting situation from my standpoint and it all seems to
come to a head in this post of March 2nd at 8:02am.

Olin Lathrop wrote:

>
> Yes, finally after many messages.  Note that I asked him in my very first
> message where he was from.  This was exactly the kind of context I was
> trying to get.  Before that I and several others, including a admin,
> thought
> this guy was a student asking for help with his homework.


This is how he was asked:

>1.) What exactly is the problem statement of this homework assignment?

>2.) Where are you located?

>3.) Is there any reason you can't do something as simple as:

When I question my wife like the first one, she usually doesn't speak to me
for a week.
The OP never said it was a home work assignment, but instead of just asking
if it is, it's put out as a given in the pretext of asking about the
"problem statement".
It's analogous to my asking my wife, (if I suspect her of being with a
person I despise) "Did you enjoy the dinner you had with Lisa last night",
when I didn't even know if she was with Lisa. I could have come right out
and asked her directly, but it makes me feel much better to be, as she puts
it, accusatory and demeaning.

Where are you located is an excellent way to ask for information.

Now, the third question. If nobody sees anything wrong with this way of
asking a question, I suggest they start a conversation with my wife like
that. She will explain your mistake both graphically and physically. "Could
you" would be a good replacement for that sentence, and save a bunch of
words also.

When I got to the part that said:

or even just thanked us for giving him idea


I was wondering if Olin really said that.
But then I continued and was assured by:


> (I really truly don't care about that last one, in a way it would be just
> waste of bandwidth.  I only
> point it out in the context that the OP never replied at all.)
>
> I have many friends who are rude, crude and seem to try their best to be
socially unacceptable, but it seems that if they feel criticized in the
least, they go ballistic. More than their actions, I despise their being
hypocritical.

I've got to hand it to Olin, he takes criticism without batting an eyelash.
I don't believe anyone could ever say that he is a hypocrite, he can take
what he dishes out.

Now, where Olin says:


> Nonsense.  Getting upset is a concious choice.


I would also say that not caring for any social niceties can also be a
conscious choice. There are development disorders, such as asperger's
syndrome, where high intelligence coexists with a lack of empathy and
difficulty with social skills, but in most cases people choose to be
socially disagreeable for a reason.

This last section seems to sum it up:


> Helping people with their silly-ass problems or homework or whatever isn'=
t
> the aim, good discussion is.  However, people coming here asking question=
s
> is how good discussion starts.  That's why we pretend to be helpful and
> often actually are.  This is no different from a company selling products=
..
> Despite the fact that companies often claim things like "we want to make
> your life better" or "we want to save you money on car insurance", that's
> all just a load of marketing.  They want to make money selling you car
> insurance.  They may decide the best way to do that is to sell it for a
> good
> price, provide great customer service, or whatever.  There is nothing wro=
ng
> with that, in fact it's the basis of the capitalist system.  But, helping
> you is not their goal, it is the means to their goal.
>
> Our "profit" is good discussions with perhaps some new information
> occasionally coming to light we didn't previously know.  The "product" we
> "sell" to get that is helping people with their PIC or electronics
> problems.
> There is nothing wrong with that, only if you pretend otherwise.
>

The people that are running this list believe that providing "good customer
service" is the way to reach their goal. Anyone who interferes with that is
driving off profits.

I believe Olin should lighten up and make a conscious effort to treat
everyone with the respect they would like to be afforded. And, I believe
that most everyone else on the list should learn to take criticism as well
as Olin has in the past.
The chance of either of these events happening is so small that I think it
can be disregarded.

Olin, I personally don't know you, and I'm sorry if I made any assumptions
or statements that offended you. I appreciate the knowledge you bring to
this group and the many questions you answer. I'm just adding one lone voic=
e
to the mantra of bringing it down a notch, mainly because I want to see you
remain an active participant to this group.

Also, apologies to Russell as I didn't mean to usurp your title as King of
the lengthy post. You still have sole right to the title in loquaciousness.



Roger Kadau
--=20
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