Various spiral screw in thingies are available as soil anchors for braces o= r guys or direct post supports. It occurred to me that the right diameter car coil springs may do a good job. Grind a nice point / angled flat at one end. Driving them and attachin= g to them may be assisted by using part of what they came out of. Motorcycle shocks or front suspension parts may also provide springs but liable to be lower diameter/ generally more wimpy / probably dearer. Pitch or profile no= t optimised for soil applications (not purposefully or probably anyway) but worth a try. A common enough part may be available at steel scrap cost or free with identical parts available in volume. Time for a play ... :-). Otto ... ? :-) Russell --=20 http://www.piclist.com PIC/SX FAQ & list archive View/change your membership options at http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist .