> You are confusing anecdotes with physics. Alas, flight 587, ran into excessive levels of anecdote and didn't survive. The US's second most lethal air crash. Interestingly, while the crash WAS precipitated by the effects of wake turbulence much as Carl (I think it was) described, the overall cause as reported by the NTSB was excessive rudder control force in response to the turbulence. They concluded that if the pilot had left things alone instead of fighting it as he did then the craft would have survived. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Airlines_Flight_5= 87 Russell --=20 http://www.piclist.com PIC/SX FAQ & list archive View/change your membership options at http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist .