:: Perhaps what these people are doing isn't snake oil, just your :: explanation :: of it ("using the air itself") makes it seem that way? Yes, my explanation was crap. A Manta Ray glides through the water in a very energy efficient way, due in= =20 part to it's shape and the way it twists its' 'wings'. What the research=20 institute have designed is a hydrogen filled structure shaped like a Ray,=20 with wing tips and a tail that can mimic the essential body movements in=20 air that the Ray uses in water. The structure requires two 4 channel radio controlled transmitters to=20 replicate the momements. They have these devices 'flying' around the=20 research centres buildings. They hope to use what they learn to make=20 planes more fuel efficient by changing their shape and so they said,=20 because they plan to have moving wings and tail, less powerful engines will= =20 be needed. At the moment they appear to be cheating as they are relying on hydrogen to= =20 get them afloat and thereafter the Manta motion flies them. I'm not sure=20 people would be that thrilled to sit in a plane where the wing tips=20 'ripple' at the edges and where the tail of the fuselage does a whale type= =20 impressions. OTOH whilst this and many of the inventions shown (such as the= =20 Dutchman and his self walking beach creatures) seem bizzare and of no=20 purpose, I'm sure they could prove a catalyst for other more down to earth= =20 inventions. The fly powered clock for example is being used to develop bio= =20 mass fuel cells for power.=20 Colin -- cdb, colin@btech-online.co.uk on 17/01/2011 =20 Web presence: www.btech-online.co.uk =20 =20 Hosted by: www.justhost.com.au =20 =20 =20 =20 =20 --=20 http://www.piclist.com PIC/SX FAQ & list archive View/change your membership options at http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist .