Bob Blick wrote:

>> 3. If Vitaliy speaks about  anything that has any economic content,
>> even peripherally, this is "often" deemed to be politics and thus in
>> violation of the "no politics" requirement.
>=20
> I don't want to get into the specifics of political parties, but when
> I see talking points that are used by politicians in an economic
> discussion, that's politics.=20

You possibly disagree, but your argument ("ask the Bible study circle")
is used by politicians for all sort of things. Besides, it is highly
religious -- and I thought that religion is a clear no-no. I tend to not
get very aroused about religious and philosophical issues but am very
interested in them, so I don't have a problem discussing them, but it
seems some others do have a problem with that and that's why we have the
rule "no religion". Which most seem to abide by.

> The rules are clear enough. Plus, annoying the admins is not the
> smartest course to take.

It seems they are, at least on religion. But it seems to depend on the
annoyance level also, which is much less objective.

> ... and then Vitaliy decides to thrown in a political talking point
> about the USPS. So the discussion was great until Vitaliy decided to
> turn it into a platform for his political opinions.

Which didn't seem to stir up many people... the only one I actually
remember is you. So just letting it be (instead of fanning the flames)
could have worked well.

> At this point I think Vitaliy should not contribute to conversations
> that are likely to cause problems. That seems an easy solution.

I'd say that contributing in a "peaceful" way is ok, but continue to
incite is bad. Even if it is an admin who does it. IMO it wasn't only
Vitaliy who participated in the escalation. It seems odd when one who
participated in an escalation says that this is something the other
shouldn't do. (Maybe another topic for the Bible study circle...)=20

> That's where the "adult" part comes in. If everyone thinks about how
> diverse the Piclist membership is, with an understanding that we,
> especially in the US, are living in extremely partisan times, then
> the interpretation of "what is politics" becomes much easier.

It seems you don't think that this partisan polarization is a good
thing. So why act as if it were the only choice? Why polarize? There are
probably hundreds of people on this list who don't agree with Vitaliy,
some of them who don't have a problem posting, but most of them had the
self-restraint and didn't make this a polar issue.

> Russell, what do you expect to gain by this? What I am trying to get
> you to understand is that if an admin thinks something is against the
> rules, it probably is against the rules.=20

It seems there are some rules that are clear beyond interpretation by an
admin -- and it seems that these should be followed even by an admin.

> And frankly, no comments from membership is likely to raise that
> threshold in me. This is the PIC Microcontroller Discussion List, not
> a political forum.=20

Nor a religious one, right?

> If politics bothers me, and I am an admin, I am going to do my best to
> stomp on it. If some members don't like it, well, that's the way it
> is.

See, I wouldn't have seen anything at all to comment if you had sent
Vitaliy a response like "I'm Bob the admin, and this is political.
Please stop." But this is not what you did; instead you added religion
to an economic/political issue and continued to incite and polarize. Not
quite the "admin way", it seems to me.

> ... just like I do not want to know their sex, race, or religion.

So why did you bring in religion then? You don't want to know about
others' but don't have a problem letting others know about yours?

> I only did it in order to cram my message of community down your
> throats.=20

I've had my share of experiences with community and communities.
Cramming something down someone's throat generally doesn't seem to
increase the community in communities. Also, whoever thinks he has to
cram, often either misses something or has hidden (or not so hidden)
motives that are not appreciated by the crammed.=20

Gerhard
--=20
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