OK - Admin hat on. "Gentlemen", take it outside, 'please'. ___________ The last 10 or so posts on this thread have been inappropriate to the [PIC] tag and largely also to the subject, quite apart from any related admin 'requests' If y'all want to bicker and noise up the channel please do so in [OT]. IMHO, some good points and some poorly made points have been offered - that's not the point. PIC is for PIC and the "mature" members know this and should have the restraint and knowledge to EITHER just shut up OR change the tag to OT when responding. The latter action, if consistently applied by the suitably informed, would have the effect of sweeping such subject-unrelated sub threads into [OT], even if some reply in [PIC]. If some respondents subscribe to [PIC] and not to [OT] then they will probably think that their ripostes have been ignored. In the few cases where an ongoing monolog develops admins can then intervene or membrs may wish to advise them offlist that their mothers wear army boots or whatever. This comment is purposefully in [PIC] so that all involved do see it. Climbs down off horse ... . Russell -- http://www.piclist.com PIC/SX FAQ & list archive View/change your membership options at http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist