I'm not sure how much cred my opinion will really have, since I am not a frequent contributor, but more of a lurker on this list; but here goes. I used to be really afraid of somebody calling me a moron; that was an error and an impediment to progress and growth. "The wounds of a friend are faithful." (hope you'll cut me some slack there...) That said, I have never found it necessary or productive to call anyone else a moron. And there is more than one way to "help" an individual to rise above "moron" status. Over the years, I can think of people in my life that did that for me in different areas at different times. The people on this list have really helped me on a number of occasions, and I appreciate you all. I am a every-day, working engineer, and I am trying the best I can to accomplish the tasks set before me; at times I struggle with these tasks, not really knowing how I am going to get from point A to point B until it all becomes clear. The PICList helps me with that. The best, BEST, period, post I have ever seen on this list was Olin's explanation of how to design a switching power supply. There's an individual much like Olin on the MSP430 list......I think he goes by OneStone. He once gave a summary of how to design a firmware program. It was in the same class as Olin's post. Everybody on both lists saw the value in those posts. If you want to know what real love is, it is at least in part taking that time and putting forth that effort to create something that useful and then give it away for free. Not that I know Olin's motives, mind you. I can endure being called a moron once in a while to get to information like that, since I do, in fact, act like a moron on occasion. And really, does it matter what Olin or anybody else thinks of us? Here is food for thought..... it is not often that humility and extraordinary gifts and talent are found in the same individual. There are a lot of talented and gifted individuals on this list. On the other hand, it is true that many folks hate the super-competent because of intimidation or jealousy. But there is a place for all of us. I cannot change anyone or the way they behave by my own power. But in order to preserve freedom on this list, I think it is best not to sensor Olin or anyone else, and then hope for the appearance and practice of mutual respect, understanding that nobody is going to be perfect. IM(hopefully H)O. Mark Skeels Engineer Competition Electronics, Inc. TEL: 815-874-8001 FAX: 815-874-8181 www.competitionelectronics.com -- http://www.piclist.com PIC/SX FAQ & list archive View/change your membership options at http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist