> Tag changed. =A0I originally tried to post this using the > ADMIN tag since I thought that is for discussion of list > issues. That post just dissappeared without any notice, > but I don't know if that is due to email issues at my end. > > Marechiare wrote: >> Yeah, I know this is not quite the place for democracy, >> but, may I humbly wonder what the OP have commited >> to make him getting thrown under the inquisition of the >> pre-moderation? Yes, it was me who had written that grammatically incorrect stuff, my apologies; had edited to add some sarcastic and had not re-read it after the editing. > I see Bob gave you a brief answer, but it seems that was > more to avoid talking about it than to actually provide real > information. Sure it was rather cryptic as for me, I even prepared a sarcastic reply, but finally decided to click "Discard" button. > [skipped] Such censorship is totally the wrong way to > enforce anything. =A0Not only is censorship just plain wrong, > but it allows the admins to feel they are doing something ... I don't know, I got no enough power to claim what's wrong or what's right, I just try not to buy things I don't like. > [skipped] Once we finally got rid of James, things got > more reasonable. I think, this is very unfair statement towards the respected person who had been keeping the great community for many years. (10+ ?) > [skipped] Then a bunch of months ago I was told out > of the blue that I was put on moderation. Perhaps I would get it provided I knew more or less reasonable explanation of why you have [been] canceled your participation in MCHP forum too. > There was no mention of any specific incident, anything > I said, or any rule I was supposed to have broken. > I decided to see how things would work out and give > the new admins the benefit of the doubt for a while. > This went on for some months. =A0Occasionally some > message got rejected for silly reasons. =A0Then a few > months ago a perfectly reasonable message that wasn't > anywhere near the line got rejected by Russell, who is > PC off the deep end. =A0I decided I'd had enough and > wasn't going to add value to the PIClist. ok > Every time this sort of thing was discussed publicly, > the consensus was overwhelmingly in favor of not > being so heavy handed. =A0In fact it was a vote for > removing me from moderation that finally caused > James to step down. I am not sure it is correct to speak for James about what "finally caused him to step down". Your model of the events might happen to be slightly off-synch with the reality. > I know this list isn't a democracy, but it is a community. > The admins may have the final say, but the sense of > the community should be considered in making decisions. It's a huge responsibility to run a global community nowadays. It would be a good idea to get some "field" experience on the matters before making deep suggestions how to do the running safely and effectively. Do you feel strong enough to start running your own list, not just providing advices how to do it? Thank you for your reply to my post. --------------- > I think the right way to deal with people getting out of hand is twofold. > First and foremost, be tolerant. =A0Think about what harm is really done = by > what someone at the other end of the internet said. =A0If someone thinks > you're being stupid and says so, does that really matter in the end? =A0If > he's right, you've learned a lesson. =A0If he's wrong, you can rebut. =A0= As > long as its about the a action or the content of a message and not about > the person, there is no reason to get upset. > > Second when someone does get way out of line ("FU -------") be decisive, > immediate, public, but also temporary. =A0Decisive means you don't do > something half in or wussy. =A0You ban the offender. =A0Public means you > announce publicly that so-and-so is banned for this-particular offense. > This is very important as it lets everyone see what line not to cross, but > also that action is taken and there is therefore no need for anyone else > to do anything more. =A0Temporary is so that everyone can recover. =A0It's > very unlikely that the person that said FU is going to do it again right > when he comes back. =A0Bans should last from a day or two to a week or so > for something serious. =A0More if it happens repeatedly. =A0If you look a= t the > archives, you'll see that the discussions about the list that James hated > so much were not actually in direct response to any offense, but in > response to his action towards one. =A0If such action is finite, then the= re > will be little uproar because the problem will be resolved by itself in a > few days. > > Anyway, there have been a number of times in the last few months where > I've seen bad advice given, incomplete answers, or there was a > particularly good answer I could have given. =A0I refrained from adding > value to this list under the current conditions. =A0You can't have it both > ways. =A0You don't get to treat me unfairly and still have me help you. = =A0If > you look back at the archives, you'll see I used to provide more help than > most people here. =A0And yes, if I thought something was stupid I'd say s= o, > just like it works in Real Life. =A0If you want Russell's idea of sugar > coated reality, then I'm not the guy. =A0Unfortunately it's not easy to > notice missing content since you don't know what could have been > mentioned. =A0I find Russell's excessively PC and wordy style quite > annoying. =A0He probably finds my brief and brusk style annoying. =A0The > difference is I don't take offense by that and certainly wouldn't put him > on moderation for it. > > > ******************************************************************** > Embed Inc, Littleton Massachusetts, http://www.embedinc.com/products > (978) 742-9014. =A0Gold level PIC consultants since 2000. > -- > http://www.piclist.com PIC/SX FAQ & list archive > View/change your membership options at > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist > -- = http://www.piclist.com PIC/SX FAQ & list archive View/change your membership options at http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist