OK Gerhard, you win. Until things cool off, I will refrain from responding to your posts. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gerhard Fiedler" To: "Microcontroller discussion list - Public." Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2009 04:26 Subject: Re: [TECH] Upfront requirements and lean development > Vitaliy wrote: > >> You keep covering your ears, and screaming "AGILE IS CRAP BECAUSE >> VIDEO IS BAD DOCUMENTATION!". > > No. You scream. You are the only one who screams here. Feel free to > actually read the messages and find a single place where anybody besides > you has screamed. > >> can _you_ read, Gerhard? > > Should I answer this? It seems that only a moron can ask such a > question. > >> "Communication", not "documentation" > > As I wrote before, (good) documentation /is/ communication. This is > /obvious/. If your documentation doesn't communicate anything, it really > wasn't worth writing. > > And while "Communication" is the title of the article, it seems to me > the article has contents also. And the curve I'm talking about, kind of > hidden below the title, in the contents of the article, is named > "Documentation". For a reason, I presume. > >> To most people, it is obvious that a video conference is a more >> efficient way to communicate, than passing on a spec. > > I don't know who those "most people" you cite are. Maybe they are > semi-illiterate? (I think "most people" in fact are semi or fully > illiterate.) It's definitely not obvious to me. Watching videos takes > too much time. I skipped most of the basic lectures in university, > because it is not an efficient means to get some stuff presented. > (Except for the few "spirited" lecturers, of course, but they were rare > in the basic courses.) Reading up on the stuff, I could do it in a > fraction of the time required. And I could explain it to the ones who > attended the lectures regularly. > > I still wait for anyone to say "yes, I'd find it really helpful to have > datasheets in video form; it would help me get so much more efficient". > Datasheets may be an extreme example, but they are just documentation, > "a spec" as you seem to call it. > > I also refer back to the billing system. Can you imagine a video > "documenting" this billing system? Instead of condensing all the > information into a readable and searchable document, they could have > simply shot videos from all the meetings they had with members of the > different departments where they discussed the thousands of individual > procedures and how they are related. That video would probably take a > few months to watch. Doesn't seem very efficient to me. > > >>>> It's funny when people diss on certain aspects of lean development, >>>> and try to convince me that it cannot work >>> >>> Who said that it cannot work? You really should avoid trying to defend >>> what hasn't been attacked. >> >> I refer you once again to Rolf's attempt at agile comedy. And to be >> fair, to some of your and Olin's posts as well. > > You don't refer to squat. I never said that it cannot work, that's why > you can't come up with real examples. Repeating this doesn't change > this. All I said is that there are situations where some of the rules > don't hold, some of the approaches don't work well and alternatives work > better. And I stand by this, and nothing what you have brought up so far > has had anything to do with this. You seem to be arguing against people > who are saying that "it cannot work" (in general), but there are no such > people. All anybody ever said is that they have seen certain situations > where it didn't or couldn't work. Which you, if you had a bit of > humility inside yourself, could just accept. But I guess some do and > can, and some don't and can't. > > Gerhard > -- > http://www.piclist.com PIC/SX FAQ & list archive > View/change your membership options at > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist -- http://www.piclist.com PIC/SX FAQ & list archive View/change your membership options at http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist