On Nov 7, 2008, at 8:39 AM, Wouter van Ooijen wrote: >> It's a bit sad that it has become less possible to "bootstrap" >> yourself into microcontrollers based on your PC and parts from a junk >> drawer, but... > except for some higher-end uC that have an USB bootloader (IIRC Atmel > ARMs) But the package is not exactly newbie-frendly.. or for that matter: Chips sold by third parties with serial (usually) bootloaders already built in. Ardunio bare chips are about $6, PicAxe is in this category... BillW -- http://www.piclist.com PIC/SX FAQ & list archive View/change your membership options at http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist