On 20 Mar 2008 at 9:48, Gerhard Fiedler wrote:

> Vitaliy wrote:
> =

> > Gerhard Fiedler wrote:
> >> [...] It probably pre-dates most of the Christian (totalitarian) roots
> >> our culture is based on.
> > =

> > Gerhard, I'd like to point out that..
> > =

> > Christian !=3D totalitarian
> > =

> > ..and some people on this list may find your comment offensive. I don't=
 see =

> > how your comment is different from calling someone's beliefs "fascist".
> > =

> > As "religious" debates are forbidden, I only ask you to refrain from si=
milar =

> > comments in the future.
> =

> I thought I might have to explain this. This is not about religion, this =
is
> about history (notice the expression "roots our culture is based on",
> indicating a quite long history, not just a lifetime or two). =

> =

> Almost from its very inception as a formal religion in the 4th century,
> Christianity intimately connected itself to totalitarian regimes, and
> actively participated in justifying their existence. See it becoming the
> Roman official state religion, see the "Heilige R=F6mische Reich Deutscher
> Nation", or the Anglican Church. While large parts of the Protestant
> Reformation split from this pattern, in terms of historic and cultural
> roots this is fairly recent, and wasn't a mainstream movement for quite
> some time. Looking over two thousand years of Christian history, you'll s=
ee
> most of its major leaders quite intimately linked to totalitarian regimes
> and actively involved with the justification of their existence and power.
> Democracy (as principle, not a form of government) is still not a strong
> trait of at least the Catholic branch of Christianity (see e.g. the histo=
ry
> of Liberation theology).
> =

> So while you are correct that Christian !=3D totalitarian, you are wrong =
in
> implying that I said Christian =3D=3D totalitarian. But that they are
> historically (again, note the word "roots") intimately linked is IMO a
> fact.
> =

> With this I don't (and didn't intend to) say anything about the Christian
> faith itself or today's practicing Christians. I was talking about history
> (and historic facts), not religion, and I didn't call anybody's beliefs
> anything (not fascist, not totalitarian, nor anything else).
> =

> If you think I got my facts wrong, please correct if you so wish.
> =

> Gerhard
> =

> -- =



	Just to add some wood to the fire:

	http://www.nobeliefs.com/exist.htm

	MJ





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