Carl,

  I know of the pains when we are with no scope. I
suggest this instead. You have some PIC skills :) Use
it to determine the charge and discharge time. It
would provide the data you need after programming it.


--- Carl Denk <cdenk@alltel.net> wrote:

> Thanks for the link on calculation. I noted that it
> used SPICE which I 
> have used also for OP-AMP design in particular.
> While searching for 
> impedance and other data on the relay, I found some
> interesting info:
>
http://ecatalog.squared.com:8080/TechLibWeb/download/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fecatalog%2Esquared%2Ecom%2Fpubs%2FMachine%20Control%2FRelays%20and%20Timers%2FRelays%2C%20General%20Purpose%2FRelays%2C%20Power%2F8501CT0301%2Epdf
> 
> Typical pick up time     AC coil: approximately 12
> ms
>                                         DC coil:
> approximately 18 ms
> 
> Typical Drop Out time   AC coil: approximately 12 ms
>                                          DC coil:
> approximately 7 ms
> 
> It seems that by going to a DC coil, I might move
> the problem to 
> switching in the other direction. There was no other
> info on the coils. 
> Interesting that they claim pick up and drop out
> times to be the same 
> with AC. I only have DMM's and a logic probe for

  I don know how they come out with that
calculation...
So I won't be able to provide reference on the AC
calculation...... Have to read more...

> test equipment, wish I 
> had a scope, but it's not in family budget at this
> time. Without the 
> inductance of the coil, or a scope to measure times
> and things, think 
> that's a dead end. Don't know where the times above
> would set on the 
> curves calculated if knew impedance. Don't mind
> spending a few $$ on 
> parts to try out. Don't have negative attitude with
> respect to learning, 
> i.e. now know how to implement PIC project,
> programming in "C" , ladder 
> logic, "BASIC" that skills were slim 3 years ago,
> but my time, even 
> though retired has priorities too. :( Usually
> pointed in a direction, I 
> can take it from there. :)
> 
  Learning is VERY rewarding when you fix stuff :)

  John


       
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