At 10:50 AM 3/29/2007, Joshua Shriver wrote: > What kind of PIC programmer do you all recommend? I searched >online, and even on ebay there are many listed for under $50. I plan >to do this as a hobby so I dont need anything robust. Hi there, Josh. You are going to get lots of recommendations for the Microchip products (PICkit, PICkit2, ICD) as well as a couple of highly respected 3rd part programmers from Wouter (WISP) and Olin Lathrop's Easy PIC programmers. All are good suggestions. I'm going to toss in a another suggestion: I'm fond of the programmers that Tony Nixon designed. He sold the designs to Peter Crowfoot of KITS-R-US (www.kitsrus.com). Last I heard, Bob Axtell (on this list) is now the person doing on-going development of those programmers. As is usual, these have been cloned and are being sold VERY inexpensively on eBay. They go by the KITS-R-US part numbers: K128 (USB only, Flash parts only) K149 (USB & Serial, Flash and "C" PICs) K150 (not sure what goodies K150 brings to the table) The K149 is a *nice* programmer. Works with both serial and USB ports, field-upgradable firmware, has both a ZIF socket and ICSP pins. Its downside is that it uses its own software (does not integrate within MPLAB) and that different-sized PICs fit into different locations on the socket. We've been using K128 (USB only, Flash parts only) and K149 (USB & Serial, C-series and Flash parts) for quite a while now. One of my developers uses only the K149 - he sez that Microchip's PS+ is just too slow. One of the neat things about the K149 software is that is continually monitors the specified HEX file. When that file changes because of a re-compile, it is automatically re-loaded into the programmer and sits waiting for you to drop in the chip and hit the Program button. The last pair of K149 programmers I purchased cost me US $36 each plus shipping. Since that particular supplier is in Vancouver (BC, Canada), shipping costs to me were low. Finally, you will also see others saying that ICSP is the *ONLY* way to go. I have to disagree. ICSP can be made to work in many situations but you will find that you may have to go through some hoops to use it in some projects. Some of my products don't / can't use ISCP. Part of the reason is cost. Other products *DO* use ICSP but require the use of the ICSP buffer circuits I've described several times over the past few years. The pins used for ICSP clock and data are heavily loaded and most ICSP programmers just can't supply enough current down those lines. Still other products can use ICSP from almost anybody's programmer. My take on ICSP is this: its a great tool for experienced PIC people. People completely new to PIC controllers and electronics in general should avoid while they are in the beginning stages of learning all this new stuff. Hope this helps. dwayne PS - Don't fall into the trap of trying to use a NPPP or JDM or even a TAIT do-it-yourself programmer. Also avoid Myke Predko's programmer. All of these can work quite well. However, all of these are known to NOT work under varying and fairly common circumstances. Quite frankly, not knowing whether your PIC got programmed properly or not simply is NOT worth the hassle when you can't figure out why your current project doesn't work. Far better to spend a modest sum of money and have a programmer that works properly, every time. Then you can concentrate your debugging efforts on your circuit and your code. dwayne -- Dwayne Reid Trinity Electronics Systems Ltd Edmonton, AB, CANADA (780) 489-3199 voice (780) 487-6397 fax Celebrating 22 years of Engineering Innovation (1984 - 2006) .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .- `-' `-' `-' `-' `-' `-' `-' `-' `-' Do NOT send unsolicited commercial email to this email address. This message neither grants consent to receive unsolicited commercial email nor is intended to solicit commercial email. -- http://www.piclist.com PIC/SX FAQ & list archive View/change your membership options at http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist