Hope this counts as PIC, not EE I've seen circuits for very simple, efficient, transformerless, non-isolated power supplies such as http://www.aaroncake.net/circuits/supply5.htm . Would I have a chance of running a very low frequency PIC16 on this type of supply? would i need to stick a 7805 in too? or is it simply too noisy? thanks jon -- http://www.piclist.com PIC/SX FAQ & list archive View/change your membership options at http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist