Hi, I am not sure if my prevoius message on this went through as I forgot to put the [PIC] tag in the subject so here we go again: Is anybody has experience on SMD sized PICs used as a hobbyist / small production? Couple of questions pop into my mind: - There is no socket or whatever, so how do you program it without ICSP? - I could not find any info on the program memory types, so are they OTP or Flash or anything else? - What tool do you recommend for dealing with SMD stuff (small production as 10 maybe 15 a month with 5-10 parts on the board so I would need a bit cheaper ones no matter if it takes more time or more expensive to build with) - Is there any place in Ireland or UK where I have a chance to buy copper-clad boards that are not as thick (the standard is 1.6mm I think and I was thinking of having as thin as possible as the size will be really small -- the lighter is better Thanks Tamas -- unPIC -- The PIC Disassembler http://unpic.sourceforge.net -- http://www.piclist.com PIC/SX FAQ & list archive View/change your membership options at http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist