> > Your wife, your mother, and your wife's mother. > > Hmmm, I have only a mother (and contrary to popular belief > I have a named father too) > > I was thinking someone who has overcome the odds or done > something special outside of their field rather than someone > who has got where they are, and probably couldn't help but > get where they are, by natural ability Those people tend not to shout 'look at me a lot', and tend not to be noticed (by media) anyway. A recent list of top 20 theoretical physicists (nominated by their peers) didn't included Stephen Hawkings, arguably the worlds most famous. Those 20 would never be nominated in any other popularity test. I've no idea who they are, or if I should admire them. The 'photon' thread started to make my head hurt. It's hard when you don't care for the usual celebrity\sportstar\politician crowd. Last time I had to do something like that down I put Hedy LeMarr. When asked why I nominated Delilah, I said "huh, you mean she did something besides frequency hopping radio controlled torpedoes?". Failing that, someone else's wife? Tony -- http://www.piclist.com PIC/SX FAQ & list archive View/change your membership options at http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist