James Newtons Massmind wrote:

>> Are you going to use a "no-parts"/"no-cost" soldering-iron also ?? If
>> not, why is it that the *programmer* has to be of that kind ?
> 
> All true. But that misses the point, which is hard to see if you aren't
> a "hacker." (in the true sense of the word) 
> 
> I have a t-shirt that shows the view over a set of motorcycle handlebars
> and it says "if you don't ride, you wouldn't get it." I guess this is
> the same sort of thing. There is a joy in understanding something from
> the very bottom to the top. 

I think I understand this, to some degree... like many here, having worked
on many levels of computing, from electronics upwards to development of
multi-tier server architectures, it's a special delight knowing, when
working on the umpteenth layer up in the heights, that I /could/ go down
there :)

> With an application program on the PC, mac, PDA, whatever, part of that
> zoom is broken. I guess if the software is open source and well
> documented... 

I carefully disagree. I think such an async serial programmer may be a cool
hack, just for the heck of it; I can see that. But it's also somewhat a
violation of the programming algorithm, and in that not exactly instructive
for a beginner, and also not helping the (my) zoom. A cleanly written and
well documented open source application that implements the pin wiggling as
described in the programming specs and shows a few good programming
practices and provides, among others, a template for how to create
multi-platform command line serial port access applications is, IMO, a
/lot/ more instructive and -- for me at least -- does not break the zoom.
To the contrary: it probably would add a bit to the depth of zoom of most
of us.

<highly exaggerated> I think brainlessly downloading a byte stream from a
web site and then copying that out the serial port using commands copied
from a web page on that site does not contribute to any beginner's
education, nor to any hacker's delight or increase the depth of any zoom :)
<back to normal>

Gerhard

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