R. I. Nelson wrote: > How much better off would > you and the world be if, instead of trying to publicly embarass > or put down someone on the list you would just give them a kind > remark correcting them or take it offlist to instruct them of the > proper thing. This depends on the situation. An honest mistake with no ill intention shouldn't be put down. However, dealing kindly and privately with someone trying to "get away with" something is not useful for two reasons. First, it's rather painless for that person so there is little incentive to not do it again. Second, since nobody else saw the admonition it gives the impression that the behavior is condoned. This is an area where I have a strong disagreement with James. Many of the bigger problems on this list were because the standards have been and are more ambiguous than they need to be. If James sees a post he doesn't like and sends a message to the offender, only the offender learns from that. In fact, everyone else learns exactly the opposite. They see a marginal post with no apparent reaction from James and therefore can only assume that it was acceptable. Another advantage of reacting publicly is that the response is likely to be more reasoned and less knee jerk emotional. You will probably say things differently if you think 1500 people will read it than if you think only one person will read it that you've already decided is a bozo. James has a tendency to assume hostile intent when someone strays over the line a bit. This results in him getting emotional and overreacting. I think in the vast majority of cases there is no hostile intent, only the inevitable differences in judgement between two people especially when the rules are a bit vague in the first place. Sometimes there are also outright errors which may be a little harder to differentiate from hostile intent. However honest error should be given the benefit of doubt without further evidence. Using a sledge hammer when a fly swatter would do is just going to piss off people towards the admins needlessly. This is not a good thing in general, and certainly counter productive if you are asking for volunteer support for the list. The world has gotten way to PC, and we seem to have forgotten that it takes two to be offended. We immediately jump to the conclusion that the offender was at fault when it is just as likely that the offendee was at fault. In other words, if you can't take someone telling you that you've been an idiot, you don't belong on a mail list, the internet, or much anywhere else in life. Someone telling you that they have perceived you as acting like an idiot is actually useful information, whether you agree with the assesment or not. Take it as a single point of information and not personally. In other words, get over it. (Disclaimer: I am not an admin and these are only my personal opinions.) ****************************************************************** Embed Inc, Littleton Massachusetts, (978) 742-9014. #1 PIC consultant in 2004 program year. http://www.embedinc.com/products -- http://www.piclist.com PIC/SX FAQ & list archive View/change your membership options at http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist