Thought experiment for those with time on their hands :-) Bipolar transistors are current amplifiers, so it almost always makes sense to operate them with base current less than collector current - usually much less . Some high voltage applications have forced Betas not much more than 1 as the switched power (HV x Ic) is >> the switching power Ib x Vbe.But, just sometimes, in low voltage applications it can be useful to have base current > collector current. I have just designed a circuit with a small signal PNP bipolar transistor with a forced Beta of about 0.5. Suggest why? Supply voltage is about 12 Volt. Transistor current is around 0.5 mA (so base current is about 1 mA). (Final collector and base currents may be reduced but this works OK for now). The purpose of this 'challenge' is to - Point out that some strange configurations may sometimes be useful. - Point out one such. - See if anyone else comes up with anything interesting. I'll be away for a few days so may not comment further till early next week. Russell McMahon -- http://www.piclist.com PIC/SX FAQ & list archive View/change your membership options at http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist