Couldn't this have been trimmed for god's sake ????? More than 10kB and I've no idea who said what in what order I mean, come on............... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob Axtell" To: "Microcontroller discussion list - Public." Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2006 12:38 PM Subject: Re: [OT]Non-Disclosure, Non-Compete, & Inventions Agreement Robertino Benis wrote: >Hi Aaron, > >Is that in California? If so, forget about non-competing agreements :-) >Non-compete employment agreements are illegal in California. Business and >Professions Code =A7 16600 provides that "every contract by which anyone is >restrained from engaging in a lawful profession, trade, or business of any >kind is to that extent void." Unless is a business owner or a partner. > >Remember the case former Aetna employees in California vs. Aetna Medical >Insurance. > >California is a heaven as far as that part is concerned: an employee may >literally walk out the office and walk into the competitor's office and >start working. Of course, you cannot sell secrets - that's illegal. > >If you're not in the California, then: > >1. 2 years is just plain too much, negotiate it. You really cannot foresee >events in the next 2 years _after_ you terminate the employment. I used to >work with a big corporation in the Pacific Northwest, and that part was >really a pain in the ***, though it lasted for "only" 1 year. > >2. Non-disclosure is something what reasonably you should agree to. You >shouldn't steal secrets from your employer, and you are probably ok with >that. > >3. Get a rid of that part " which the Company may be interested " - it's too >broad, and they could take you to court for anything. Having more cache for >lawyers then you, that could put you in a bad position. > >4. "moonlighting" is something many IT companies I know about and worked for >generally don't tolerate. Avoid it if you can, and don't sign it. Leave it >to your immediate manager to decide if your performance is affected by it. >You should be able to create something offsite, in your spare time, if you >like. Then sell it or make extra money doing it. This has nothing to do with >your employer, unless you are using his equipment and doing it during your >working hours. > >If HR threatens you, threaten them back. > >Good luck! > >Cheers, >r. > >-----Original Message----- >From: piclist-bounces@mit.edu [mailto:piclist-bounces@mit.edu] On Behalf Of >Aaron >Sent: Sunday, January 01, 2006 6:24 PM >To: piclist@mit.edu >Subject: Re: [OT]Non-Disclosure, Non-Compete, & Inventions Agreement > >On 12/22/05, I orignally wrote: > > >>A not-so-hypothetical scenario... it the middle of your 3rd week on a new >>job -- which you really like and enjoy. Now the HR guy comes to by, hands >>you a couple sheets of paper, and says to review this Non-Disclosure, Non- >>Compete, and Inventions Agreement that he forgot to mention and have you >>sign. >> >>Among other items, it contains the following 3 paragraphs... >> >>"The Employee agrees to keep the company informed of his ideas and >>suggestions towards the technical development of the lines of equipment to >>be engineered, sold and/or managed by the Company. Employee further >> >> >agrees > > >>that he will disclose promptly to the Company any and all inventions, >>improvements, and developments, hereinafter referred to as "Inventions," >>conceived or made by the Employee during his employment, alone or in >>conjunction with others, relating in any way to the business of the >> >> >Company > > >>or in which the Company may be interested, and that all such Inventions >> >> >and > > >>all information and records in regard thereto shall be assigned to and >>become the exclusive property of the Company..." >> >>"It is the intent of the Company that the Employee's sole remuneration be >>for services rendered on behalf of the Company; it is not in the Company's >>interest for upper-level employees to "moonlight." Therefore, the >> >> >Employee > > >>should either arrange any taxable compensable endeavors for others through >>the Company, or shall review his plans with, and have them approved by, >>management before commitments are made, and the Company promises that such >>approval will not unreasonably be withheld." >> >>"In event Employee's employment is ended by either party, he has the right >>to use the training an experience gained from his employment with company >> >> >to > > >>provide for his livelihood, except as reasonably limited by this >> >> >Agreement, > > >>with Company's customers, other customers in the industry, or in related >>fields of employment; however, the Employee agrees not to work directly >> >> >for > > >>any competitor of the Company, nor indirectly as salesman, agent, >>consultant, soliciting representative or sub-contractor, or in any other >> >> >way > > >>promote the sale, development, or use of a competitor's product, or >>products, while he is employed by Company and for a two year period >>following the end of his employment with Company." >> >>What are your thoughts on the above and what would you do? >> >>Aaron >> >> > > > >I just got back in town and am attempting to catch up on a bunch of email -- >thanks for all the responses. Several people inquired as to my location -- >it's in the USA. > >For now my plan is to...ignore the paper and hope HR forgets about it. >Unfortunately, they have another new person starting this week so HR's >memory may get jogged. If I get further, repeated requests to sign it, it >will be handed back with several changes for them to review. The primary >one being the removal of the "or in which the Company may be interested" >phrase in the inventions section. I also have a several projects developed >in my spare that I will bring in to support my case for removal of this >phrase. > >Regarding 'not allowed to work for a competitor within 2 years' portion of >the agreement - to my knowledge there are no competitors within commuting >distance so it is probably a non-issue. Things could change, but most of my >family is here and I have no long term plans to relocate. Any case, I'll >request that they furnish a list of competitors and make it a part of the >agreement. > > > I've been away from Georgia for 4 years now, but even Georgia rendered null and void any NDA lasting longer than 3 years, and that included employee contracts/agreements.. >Moonlighting -- this one is interesting as my ex-boss just contacted me >asking if I have any free time he can pay me for! I plan to discuss this >with my new boss this week and get his reaction. This will help me know how >to handle the 'moonlighting' portion of the agreement. > >I really believe that this is a boilerplate document forgot about by the HR >person. I don't believe they intentionally mislead me or negotiated in bad >faith. My boss is pretty reasonable and I expect that reasonable >modifications to this agreement shouldn't pose any significant problems. > >Aaron > > -- Note: To protect our network, attachments must be sent to attach@engineer.cotse.net . 1-520-777-7606 USA/Canada http://beam.to/azengineer -- http://www.piclist.com PIC/SX FAQ & list archive View/change your membership options at http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist -- = http://www.piclist.com PIC/SX FAQ & list archive View/change your membership options at http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist