A few days ago I posted my first piclist posting, asking for some advice about tutorials about pic programming. I received a lot of very helpful replies from experienced people, and after spending a few days looking at the different tutorials thought it might be helpful to other newbies to give my thoughts. First, I think that all the tutorials approach the subject from the viewpoint of a hardware person who wants to learn something about programming, rather than from the viewpoint of a software person who knows how to program (although not a pic) but needs a lot of guidance on the hardware aspects of things. The reason that I say this is that a lot of knowledge about such subjects as, for example, A/D conversion seems to be taken for granted. Us programmer types are not necessarily all that familiar with such things. :-) We should be, I agree, but I think that more emphasis on exactly what is happening with the hardware in even the most trivial circuit would be useful. Second, none of the available tutorials really seem to be completely up-to-date. I do not know much about how fast Microchip comes out with new products, and of course am too much of an inexperienced newbie to really say anything particularly intelligent about this subject, but I have this feeling that by the time a tutorial gets written, edited, and put out for general consumption, that the technology has moved on. Probably no way to fix that, but it sure would be nice to see a tutorial that started out with the new stuff available. (Are there any tutorials for the new ds30 pics that I read about?) Third, every tutorial seems to excel in certain areas and be weak in others. This probably reflects the background of the author, and since they all have done a better job than I could ever do I am definitely not being critical -- but I would very much second the advice of one of the people who advised me -- that a newbie should use several tutorials rather than just one. Fourth, after reading a good deal, it seems clear that building a programmer, rather than buying one, is a good idea for a newbie like me. Not for someone who is doing this stuff for a living, of course -- but just to further my education as to how all this stuff works. It just seems like, to me anyway, that building a programmer and getting it to work would be important. I might be wrong on that one, though. Fifth, and last, one thing that is fast becoming obvious is that my electronic background is a lot weaker than I thought, after looking at the material. I thought my background was pretty good (two years of pre-engineering), but it definitely needs improving. Probably most of us who have played around with electronics have a copy of "The Art of Electronics," by Hayes and Horowitz, on the bookshelf. But perhaps a lot of newbies like me do not know that there is a companion book called "Student Manual for the Art of Electronics" by the same authors, which offers a whole lot more down-to-earth details.. I found one of these on Amazon.Com for $17 and plan to use it extensively in furthering my knowledge of what I am doing. And just in case you might wonder just what I am doing, let me just say that my college education got interupted when the family grew unexpectedly, and that now I am an associate manager at a place that does a lot of business around lunchtime. But I have a little corner of the bedroom in the apartment that I can use for a workshop, and by agreement with my wife the time between 8 PM (after the baby goes to sleep) and midnight (when I go to sleep) is mine to further my self-education. So thanks for listening, and I hope that perhaps some of the comments are useful to other newbies (I feel sure the old-timers will yawn and delete the message. :-) Take care, Bill -- http://www.piclist.com PIC/SX FAQ & list archive View/change your membership options at http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist