Let me share some of my limited knowledge in China. I left China in 1997 and have since resided in Singapore. Still I think I am better informed than most of the people in this list. If the better-off USA hobbyists are feeling that US$35 are high entrance fee to pay to go into dsPIC or higher-end PIC18F, the Chinese hobbyists should feel it to be even higher since the average GDP is about only US$1200 and even the "rich" east coast cities like Shanghai and Beijing are only about US$5000. Some of them complained the high costs and so all those cheap clones got followers. However I still see a lot of students buying these kits and even US$200 ARM9 kits (to run ucLinux and uCosII) in China because they see the potentials. With 3.5 million college and university students graduated (I guess more than 50% of them are engineering students) every year, the job market is so competitive that the students are eager to learn. English and IT are the top areas they spend money on. For engineering students, MCU/DSP/FPGA are some hot areas as well. MCU forums are hot in China and Microchip is sponsoring the PIC forum in 21ICBBS (http://www.21ic.com). Not suprisingly, the Philips LPC distributors sponsor the LPC ARM sections and another one is sponsoring the 51 section. So I guess there is some difference. I guess the situation is similar in India. Regards, Xiaofan -----Original Message----- From: Ravi [mailto:chiptech@vsnl.com] Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 2:14 PM To: Microcontroller discussion list - Public. Subject: [PIC] PICmicro tools for hobbyists {was: [PIC] dsPIC for hobbyists) I would like to mention the growth of PICmicro in India due to the availability of low cost development tools. ... If affordable compilers/programmers/debuggers and offcourse reprogrammable devices are made available, then the usage and sales of the devices will automatically grow. Cheers Ravi Pailoor -- http://www.piclist.com PIC/SX FAQ & list archive View/change your membership options at http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist