> And how are people supposed to support themselves while they create > these > free tools for you? There's an excellent example here: http://www.embedinc.com :-) Sounds like you're 'having a bob each way'. There's a place for the free amongst the paid, and you obviously subscribe to this concept by your actions. Nobody can survive without income of some sort, and I'm sure (especially as he explicitly said so :-) ) that John didn't mean that ALL the work that a software writer produced should be free. There's an obvious case to be made for suppliers providing free tools to support their products. Different suppliers draw the line at different places. Some Asian suppliers of ultra high volume products charge for everything. Some manufacturers provide free assemblers. Some (such as Microchip and Atmel) supply free IDE's as well. And some (eg Zilog) provide free ANSI C compilers. Interestingly Zilog pay a fee per C compiler registered (not per dev kit sold with a CD in it). RM -- http://www.piclist.com PIC/SX FAQ & list archive View/change your membership options at http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist