I'll reply to this post as it covers most of the others on the subject. Olin Olinated: > I enabled OT a while ago because I noticed ... >This list is of course primarily about PICs, Surprisingly (perhaps) I think not. I think its (arguably) about electronics with a PIC microporocessor bias and a good dollop of related technology. (Also a lesser dollop of unrelated technology). Not meaning to be PICcy (groan) but I think it's important to stake out the coe ground appropriately. Despite the "PIClist" name it fundamentally encompasses the above. > I think it makes sense to have the [PIC] and [EE] topics. > That leaves any remaining technical discussion of the broader > embedded > systems and their technologies in the great unwashed realm of [OT]. Agree. > Unfortunately [OT] is overrun with way too much stuff that has > absolutely > nothing to do with PICs or embedded systems. Agree only partially. I think it would be a great shame to "noise up" EE tag with non electronic material. I would greatly love to see a greater number of tags. I have suggested such on a number of past occasions but James has been, so far, happy with where what we have so far. I must admit to being completely unable to understand the reasons he gives. (No rudeness intended - statement of fact). I would like to see a [WOT] (or equivalent) tag and a [TECH] tag. Tech gets the steam engines, walking loggers, trebuchets, Mars missions, moholes, balloons, rockets or whatever. Whether PC's and Pascal and languages in general and similar go in TECH or EE is TBD. OT maybe all that is needed for whats left but if one wants to distinguish then WOT still excludes hard core religion, politics and sex, profanity, rudeness flames etc. It allows eg my carefully considered "they came for the innocents but I wasn't an innocent :-) so I did nothing" Corby post. It allows evolution discussions as long as they are not eg principally religious rants. [Some won't, apparently, be able to tell the difference]. I'm not sure that adding tags imposes any real extra load on the long suffering already overworked admins. While there are undoubtedly extra duties incurred it should lighten the misposting under PIC load which seems to be James' main bugbear (possibly due to unseen complaints from other list members who specialise in PIC tag. We then have PIC AVR EE TECH OT WOT > Is there some way to > participate in the broader PIC/embedded/technology discussions > without > having to wade thru all the pointless and tedious > political/religious rants? I think that there have been few such recently. You may perhaps have mistaken the recent teaching science / origins discussion as one such. One would need to follow th thread to see the difefrence (and some can't tell the differenc eanyway :-) ). > However, what irks me is when these kinds of threads are > deliberately > started. The one from Russel this morning is a case in point. > Hopefully > people won't take the bait and start another lengthy pointless > discussion. > But alas, I expect that the troll will be well fed once again. You've given it breakfast :-). But that was a fairly rare one even for me. A very great injustice has been done. It has nothing at all to do with PICs but lots to do with people who would like to be able to travel the world without the expectation of ending up in some 3rd world jail for life because the meaning of justice is completely understaood where they happened to go on holiday. > The previous case started with an inappropriate signature line that > clearly > was meant to make a political or religious statement. Most everyone > here > either ignored it or didn't even notice (the latter for me). But > unfortunately it takes only one to light the spark. A lengthy > deliberate > message was launched just on that issues, then it went on. And on > and on > and on. All that is more or less true. But the discussion that went on and on was a derivative of the original, was NOT about the original subject per se, but was a legitimate spinoff thereof, matched the subject line well and dealt with an utterly essential area of scientific endeavour. It had by no means been beaten to death when James moved to shut it down because, as far as I can see, several people were trolling with provocative unrelated anti religious statements aimed at pushing other people into contentious areas, which had nothing to do with the actual conversation,. Pookie, you should know better by now - no loaves and fishes for you this week !!!. > What's the answer? Well I guess the current answer is "Too bad, > that's OT". Thjat's been James' answer so far. I'd like a new tag or two fwiw (not much so far). > 1 - Broaden the definition of the [EE] topic to include the greater > embedded > systems the PIC is in and their technology. I think most people who > are > interested in PICs and the circuits surrounding them would also be > interested in the systems and technology surrounding the circuits. > > 2 - Failing #1, create a new topic [EMB] or [TECH] for discussion of > what #1 > would have added to [EE]. The above 2 failt o address the Trebuchets, walking loggers etc which need a home. TECH would be fine for them and most other stuff in OT canstay there. > 3 - Absolutely positively not allow discussion of religion, or > politics that > has nothing to do with PICs, embedded systems, or their technology. > Political advocacy is strictly prohibited in any case. This has been thrashed out repeatedly and the indication has always been that people want a measure of this to be allowed. > This goes for signature lines or any other part of a message, since > those have been shown > to start such discussions. Again, sig lines so far have been deemed to allow personal expression. > I'm sorry this post adds to the noise, but at least it is about the > list and > it is about trying to resolve something that is within the > capability of the > people here to resolve. Add TECH, Add WOT redefine usage of all categories, done ... :-) RM -- http://www.piclist.com PIC/SX FAQ & list archive View/change your membership options at http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist