Thank you all very much for your help. I think I manage to get the bastard out, I downloaded all the windows updates Norton updates and spybot adwere removal program and that did it. I also installed XP SP and no longer use an administrator account as my main account, I am now in the process of changing my browser and mail. I am definitely thinking about changing to Linux but the steep learning curve has slowed things down. thanks Luis -- http://www.piclist.com#nomail Going offline? Don't AutoReply us! email listserv@mitvma.mit.edu with SET PICList DIGEST in the body