Thanks to all that listed their preferences. Great group of people here ! I think I will try the Proteus Lite and start there. The pro version is a bit pricey but for commercial use and abilities it looks pretty hard to beat. Eagle is my second choice. I have not downloaded it yet but will do that today. Again. Many thanks to the list for it's ongoing endless source of information to both the new users, such as myself, and those hardcore proffesionals that use it as well Eddie Turner, kc4awz -- http://www.piclist.com hint: The PICList is archived three different ways. See http://www.piclist.com/#archives for details.