> > Well you still need a programmer
>
> unless you buy a chip pre-programmed with a bootloader

Yeah, I tried that for a while - borrowed a programmer from a friend and
programmed several PICs w/a bootloader. Ultimately though, I decided to get
one. As my needs changed and I started using new PICs, it became too
inconvenient for me not to have a programmer.

Definitely doable though, I agree. Glitchbuster.com takes low volume
orders for pics for hobbyists and will preprogram them for you - I'm not
sure know what options he has on what they're programmed with.

> > they release any ports they were using when they're done
>
> only a sissy bootloader needs ports or pins :)

Yes - I agree. I'm pursuing this concept of a bootloader that doesn't use
any pins, in my spare time. It runs on ESP. Unfortunately Microchip still
doesn't have hardware support for it. Until they come out with an MESP
module, we have to bit bang it. Once you have your hex file, you open it
up and concentrate on each bit individually... The biggest advantage is
that I can do firmware upgrades for customers without getting out of bed
(or the lotus position). :-)

> > In this setup, I don't need to move or touch anything
> > physical (other than
> > my reset switch on MCLR) to test new code.
>
> Why use a reset switch when you have handshake lines?

I find it's just easier. My applications usually have a reset switch - so
why not use it?

-- There are 10 types of people in the world..those that understand binary
and those that don't.

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