It's true about the VMS = NT thing. I ran VMS systems for years, and it never ceases to amaze me how much of VMS appears in NT/2000/XP. Even the pagefile has the exact same name. That's standard geek humor, though, and doesn't mean anything about whether code was actually copied or not. For instance, the cisco IOS operating system source has file and function names that are "the same" as the DEC tops20 operating system, because no few of the early cisco software engineers were former DEC20 programmers. Of course, the DEC code was assembler, and the cisco code is C, so aside from a concept here and there, not much was copied other than the names. (Still, I sent out an April-1 joke "cisco licenses tops20 from DEC" some years ago, and had quite a few people who appeared to believe it...) I think fundamentally Microsoft is hated because they're held by the public to be a major instance of "techie geek success story", but in fact much of their success is due to marketing prowess (both moral and otherwise.) Their products are rarely "the best" technically, and frequenly don't originate internal to microsoft (ie MSDOS), Microsoft just makes sure that they are shoved down your throat, and/or eliminates competition. Particularly obnoxious recent example - microsoft deciding to bow out of the Macintosh web browser market. BillW -- http://www.piclist.com hint: The list server can filter out subtopics (like ads or off topics) for you. See http://www.piclist.com/#topics