Excellent idea. However, expect some resistance as selling pre-programmed chips makes the manufacturer dependent upon a sole supplier and it shifts the balance of power sharply towards the developer, a situation most manufacturers are less than thrilled with. A common solution is a code escrow deal, whereby the developer places a copy of the commented source code and other documentation with a third party escrow agent. The manufacturer has access to the code under certain conditions specified in the contract, e.g., death of developer, bankruptcy, inability to adequately support, etc. The contract negotiations center around the conditions under which the escrow is broken. The escrow agent will almost always want a court order before turning the source code over to the manufacturer, for the escrow agent's protection. If you do a Google search for "code escrow" I suspect you will find quite a few sample code escrow agreements. The code escrow solution is far from a perfect answer, as it simply postpones an argument or lawsuit. But I've seen it work in contracts I've negotiated where neither side fully trusted the other. It lets a deal get started and allows trust to be built up. Jack -----Original Message----- From: pic microcontroller discussion list [mailto:PICLIST@MITVMA.MIT.EDU]On Behalf Of Bob Axtell Sent: Saturday, May 31, 2003 7:06 AM To: PICLIST@MITVMA.MIT.EDU Subject: Re: [PIC]:Royalties At 02:21 PM 5/31/2003 +1200, you wrote: >Hope this isn't a "how long is a piece of string ?" question but > >What arrangements have people made wrt royalties from >s/w embedded in products that they developed ? I've heard >the figure of ~3% bandied around, but what does this relate >to and/or how is applied - nett, gross, other ? They have, and can. The idea is that the royalty is really your continuing support of their product in the future. So they will like the idea >If a project is developed for a client for a certain cost, eg a >number of hours at an hourly rate, would you perhaps reduce >the hourly rate (perhaps to encourage the client to use one's >services) and factor in a royalty deal or some other piece of >the product to recoup in the long run ? Obviously people's >drive and ability to get a product to market is a big variable >that, if one chose the long road, could lead to smiles on dials. >Or, more likely, not The problem is, are they trustworthy? will they pay your royalty correctly without a fight? Are they good businessmen, or will they smoke up the profits? >Simply relinquishing the s/w on job completion and moving on >to the next seems a little wussy for a volume product Here's something that DOES work. Develop the firmware at NO direct cost to them. Then, sell them the PIC already programmed with the security bit blown, at a rate that will allow you to recover your money. I'd suggest that the first 100 would cost them $30 each, then $15 thereafter. They don't have ANY control over the code, and they can't steal it. Flames, anybody? --Bob Axtell >-- >http://www.piclist.com#nomail Going offline? Don't AutoReply us! >email listserv@mitvma.mit.edu with SET PICList DIGEST in the body -------------------------- -- http://www.piclist.com hint: To leave the PICList mailto:piclist-unsubscribe-request@mitvma.mit.edu --- Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.486 / Virus Database: 284 - Release Date: 5/29/2003 --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.486 / Virus Database: 284 - Release Date: 5/29/2003 -- http://www.piclist.com hint: To leave the PICList mailto:piclist-unsubscribe-request@mitvma.mit.edu