Hey, I only made my one as a project to get me through my degree; hence my choice of components was primarily based on experience, cost, and ease of use. My PIC was only running at 4 MHz, but as my project was more of a feasibility study than a real usable product, that was fast enough. Interesting enough, 4 MHz was more than fast enough when interfacing with the LCD and eeprom chips. I liked the idea of easy expansion, and on my console there is a little connector left unused. It was originally used for programming the PIC in circuit, but I guess it could be used for adding extra peripherals.=20 There are lots of extra problems that you have to work out to develop such a system, and if you were going to try and create an actual marketable device there'd be a mass of extra ones I didn't encounter. The most fun I had was in developing an assembler for the games. When to make the transition from hand calculated 'games' to assembler generated ones, and then checking that the assembler generated the correct code, oh what fun late nights I had... I'll upload my report sometime over the next few days. I guess some circuit diagrams would be nice as well, but, as I have minimal electronics knowledge I don't know if I can face all the criticism. Oh, and I got a first for the project :) Regards, David Stubbs. > -----Original Message----- > From: pic microcontroller discussion list > [mailto:PICLIST@MITVMA.MIT.EDU] On Behalf Of Tony Harris > Sent: 01 August 2002 04:13 > To: PICLIST@MITVMA.MIT.EDU > Subject: Re: [PIC]: PIC Games "Platform" Idea >=20 > Personally, I liked Adam's idea. >=20 > You can even (if you so chose) use different pics depending on the > game - > ie - a game to play tic tac toe wouldn't necessarily need an 877 in > the game > module, so a cheaper pic can be used. >=20 > As he also said - keep things like video / sound / etc. handled > within the > box, and have a specific well documented bus between the main unit > functions > and the game "cartridge". >=20 > If you can keep the pin count down low enough on the cart, it would > be > possible to use various PIC's on the cart end. This allows the > following > of - don't use more then what is needed, and save cash where > possible. >=20 > The only thing I would change would be using perhaps a bigger main > processor - especially for video. >=20 > get something that runs faster, like an 18C442 (just as an example) > where > the instruction execution is only 100ns, much faster then the 877 at > 200ns > (it may not sound like a huge difference, but it probably would make > all the > difference in the world in bit blitting data to the LCD), plus it > has > significantly more RAM then the 877 chip. (heck, with the 18's you > can get > up to 1536 bytes!) >=20 > Like I said, I really like Adam's idea. >=20 > I think another cool thing would be - have a built in simple game or > menu > system to do other things - if no cart is installed, have the system > boot > from the built in chip, otherwise, have it boot based upon cart. >=20 > -Tony >=20 >=20 > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Kieren Johnstone" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 4:18 PM > Subject: Re: [PIC]: PIC Games "Platform" Idea >=20 >=20 > > Reality always attacks me with sticks, nasty thing. > > I thought along similar lines about the processor, maybe a Hitachi > H8S or > > something, but then I thought, "hey, gameboy used Z80"..but I > suppose it > has > > a graphics chip, sound chip, etc. too :) Plus I wanted something > I could > > consider doing with my current electrical knowledge, and with > piclist.com > > that means using a PIC ;). > > Well, now the idea has mutated into... > > > > * PIC16F877 central processor! > > * SIMM holds game code/data/extra RAM > > * That 128x64 LCD (it's the best I can find at such a price) > > * Serial + cartridge interface to download games into SIMM > > * Should I even consider using a parallel EEPROM like > > > https://www.jameco.com/cgi- > bin/ncommerce3/ProductDisplay?prmenbr=3D91&prrfnbr=3D > > 354659&cgrfnbr=3D501&ctgys=3D ? With some careful bytecode > selections, maybe > > simple/fast compression, I can't see many games going over 512kb > anyway.. > > * Bytecode interpreter; all code memory would be used to a > relatively > > CISC-like thingy; RAM copies/clears but also sprite handling, > bounding box > > interceptions, object management, finite state machines... > > * Math coprocessor from www.al-williams.com - PAK-II perhaps > > * I like the idea of a sound coprocessor; polyphonic PWM and a > graphic > > coprocessor! (as Mr Davis suggested) > > > > If I were to build such a beast I'd like to make everything open- > source > with > > construction details etc. This might make an.....interesting > early > project > > for me. Starting with a simple built-in bytecode program that > manipulates > > PORTA or something. > > > > Ta again > > Kieren > > > > > > P.S. Brendan, what range of microprocessor would you recommend? > (you have > > experience in this area?) > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Brendan Moran" > > To: > > Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 9:05 PM > > Subject: Re: [PIC]: PIC Games "Platform" Idea > > > > > > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > > > Hash: SHA1 > > > > > > > Any more suggestions would be welcomed! > > > > > > Don't use a PIC. You want something with processing power, not > > > peripherals. Microcontrollers are for peripherals. > Microprocessors > > > are for processing. Find a nice, low power microprocessor, with > a > > > slightly more complex instruction set (one that won't drive your > > > programmers insane (ex: 200 cycles for an 8by8 divide is too > much for > > > a gaming platform, find something with built in divide and > multiply) > > > > > > But the rest sounds good. In fact, if you really do like the > idea of > > > using a PIC in a gaming environment, consider using a PIC as an > IO > > > interface device. I.E. have a good MPU do all of the game > > > calculations, and memory access etc. but use the PIC as the > interface > > > to buttons, and peripherals that don't use an 8-bit bus. The > 16F877 > > > has the ability to be used on an 8-bit bus, as a slave device > for a > > > more powerful processor, via the use of the D and E ports. > > > > > > I think that if you go very far with a PIC as a game processor, > > > you'll find that you'd be better off with another processor > core. > > > > > > As near as I can tell, the PIC core was designed for use almost > > > exclusively in control applications. Its instruction set is > sadly > > > lacking in several areas, and its memory architecture leave much > to > > > be desired. I, personally, wouldn't recommend a PIC for > anything > > > that requires heavy computations. > > > > > > Now, all that holds true for the classic PIC family. I wouldn't > be > > > all that surprised if the dsPIC family was better suited to > > > computation, which is a critical part of gaming. > > > > > > However, you do need to look at the possible alternatives for a > main > > > processor, and consider the implications. I don't think that a > > > 16F877 would make an efficient choice for the main processor in > a > > > gaming platform. It'd make one heck of a programmable > peripheral > > > interface, though. You could probably run ethernet off that > baby :) > > > > > > I'd say PICs are great so long as you don't need much math. > Once you > > > do, look elsewhere, because doing much in the way of > calculations > > > takes forever on a PIC. > > > > > > Just my $0.02 > > > > > > - --Brendan > > > > > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > > > Version: PGPfreeware 6.5.8 for non-commercial use > > > > > > > iQA/AwUBPUhDFQVk8xtQuK+BEQKcLQCdERMMPd1aE2g7KwmgnlcMfVnIHpoAn2q4 > > > nbckoHEN1t6326xtVxlrFclz > > > =3DYNag > > > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > > > > > > -- > > > http://www.piclist.com hint: PICList Posts must start with ONE > topic: > > > [PIC]:,[SX]:,[AVR]: ->uP ONLY! [EE]:,[OT]: ->Other [BUY]:,[AD]: > ->Ads > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > http://www.piclist.com hint: PICList Posts must start with ONE > topic: > > [PIC]:,[SX]:,[AVR]: ->uP ONLY! [EE]:,[OT]: ->Other [BUY]:,[AD]: - > >Ads > > > > > > >=20 > -- > http://www.piclist.com hint: PICList Posts must start with ONE > topic: > [PIC]:,[SX]:,[AVR]: ->uP ONLY! [EE]:,[OT]: ->Other [BUY]:,[AD]: - > >Ads >=20 -- http://www.piclist.com hint: The list server can filter out subtopics (like ads or off topics) for you. See http://www.piclist.com/#topics