Though i have often used Diode-Resistor logic myself successfully, i have= some minor doubt about reliability in some situations, and now i grab the= opportunity to discuss: Diode-resistor cirquit, Out is high when both A anb B is high: (A)--|<--(out)--[R]---(B) 1) Diode capacitance (A)--||--(out)--[R]---(B) Think initially both A and B are low. Then A goes high. This will cause a short positive glitch on out! How short on diode capacitance and R. A risetime/curve and the= charactersistic of the input connected to out will also affect wether the= glitch will cause next gate to react. =20 Remedy: use fast low cap diode, low R, slow gate on output. Also any= capacitance on out (suchas the gate it connects to) dampens the glitch. =20 If the cirquit have more inputs (more diodes) and is guaranteed never to= switch high at the same time the problem is less (the diodes not switching= dampens the glitch). If the cirquit have more inputs (more diodes) and all switch high at the= same time the problem is worse (think all cap in parrallel). (note a diode= logic AND on a binary counters alla outputs is OK as only one at a time= switch high, the other diodes dapmens the glitch, as discussed) 2) Diode Recovery time (A)--|<--(out)--[R]---(B) Think B is high, A is low =3D> Current flows in the diode and output is= low. OK While current flows, now quickly rise A and lower B simultaneously. Outpus= shuld remain low, but: Because of the diodes reverse recovery time, now= *the diode will shortly pull out high* !! NOT OK Remedy: 1) avoid this situation *). 2) use fast low cap diode, low R, slow= gate on output *) in this situation, where A and B are outputs from a binary counter:= assign A and B respectively to the right Q to avoid this situation. (MSB= to resistor, LSB to diode) And there should be no problem. Often it is better (safer) to use resistor-transistor stages, or maybe a= cheap IC is cheaper considering less components to mount. (However i have never realised problems with CMOS4000, 5V, 1N4148, and about= 10k resistors, but have only used it in production once) /Two ore from Morgan - The pessimist (always kill problems before they kill= you(r project) There are many pitfalls in "simple" cirquits... Hej Russell McMahon. Tack f=F6r ditt meddelande 21:50 2002-05-27 enligt= nedan: >> > I have now gone to a 4040 counter with a naughty two diode and= resistor >"AND >> > gate" to drive the reset. Resistor from RESET to Vcc. Diodes from Q1 >and Q3 >> > to RESET (Anode ends). When both outputs are high the diodes block, >resistor >> > pulls up reset line and both Q's fall again. The resultant reset pulse >is >> > therefore "just long enough:" to cause reset and has the potential to >only >> > partially reset the IC. As I am using just the first two stages the >chances >> > for erroneous operation MAY be reduced compared to higher divide >ratios. >> >> This should be reliable. But you can eliminate 1 diode - use the= resistor >> in place of the diode. If you think about it, you wind up with the same >> logic. The pin with the resistor has to be HI before the reset can= occur, >> the pin with the diode also has to be HI or it is still clamping the= reset >> pin LO. In other words, 1 resistor and 1 diode makes an AND gate. > >Aaaagh ! - brilliant (yet so obvious in retrospect). >Saves a diode (with attendant component, space, loading). >A small but worthwhile victory and I can't see that it would affect the >operation in any adverse way. >Wonder if the reset race condition becomes more marginal? Well done! -- http://www.piclist.com hint: The list server can filter out subtopics (like ads or off topics) for you. See http://www.piclist.com/#topics