Most likely they are going into existing products that were designed a couple of years ago and are currently in volume production. Hmm. That's an interesting question in general... Is there a nice table somewhere that describes which of the newer PICs are direct or near-direct replacements for older chips, along with suggestions for retaining compatibility or "porting" (in either direction)? I mean, suppose I decide to build a project described in an old magazine or web page or PICLIST email message that uses one of these largely-superceded parts (16C84, 16C71, etc) I certainly would prefer not to have to hunt up a supplier for an uncommon and unattractively priced PIC variation if I can just drop in something more modern. Likewise, suppose I find a good deal on some obsolete part (the 16C71 being a particularly good example, since I purchased a small stock of them from another piclist member for <$2 each some time ago :-), but want to allow using a newer (cheaper MSRP) part if and when your stock runs out. (People keep asking about the cheapest PIC. The cheapest PIC is the one you can find a deal on on the "surplus" (loosely defined) market; but that's no way to price or budget a production design...) Finally, there's the case of wanting to do design with a flash part, with the option of putting in a cheaper (more secure?) OTP part for production. (I guess all the flash parts have 14 bit cores? That makes it a bit tougher to aim the production at 12bit core parts...) BillW -- http://www.piclist.com hint: The PICList is archived three different ways. See http://www.piclist.com/#archives for details.