At 12:49 PM 6/5/01 -0700, you wrote: > >It seems to me that as I work to make them more self reliant and self >motivating, they are less interested in pleasing me (or my wife) or doing >what I ask them to do. They have little respect for my desires because they >have been taught (by me) not to rely on me but to "do it yourself". > >I'd like to hear any advice... from parents ONLY. Please. Sorry, but if you >don't have kids, you can't hope to understand. Well, I understand, James (boy 5-1/2 yrs old, stubborn as all get out, varies between amazingly thoughtful and very aggressive), but I'm not sure it helps. ;-) They'll have to please other authority figures in the future, and do it with finesse while simultaneously advancing their own agenda. That skill is necessary for the lone wolf (with clients) as much as the company man or woman. IMHO, you may as well work on withholding discretionary things to get them to do your will (unless they can charm you out of it), because that's the way it works in the real world. If you don't show up at work, if you don't convince people you are working, you don't get paid, sooner or later. The only thing worse than people who refuse to try to please others is the ones who slave away but fail to create the *impression* that they are doing so. They end up doing all the work and not getting results. I'm not sure this can be taught other than by example! And from what I've seen, I think you are doing a great job at it, BTW. Best regards, =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Spehro Pefhany --"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward" speff@interlog.com Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com Contributions invited->The AVR-gcc FAQ is at: http://www.bluecollarlinux.com =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= -- http://www.piclist.com hint: To leave the PICList mailto:piclist-unsubscribe-request@mitvma.mit.edu