I have found and built this unit.... http://www.gbar.dtu.dk/~c888600/newpic.htm But I substituted some parts and have not made it work yet. I requires a driver ( JDM84.EXE ) and I believe it should work with PIP-02.EXE Don't quote me on the software part yet as I have not got it working. The JDM84.EXE does detect the presence of the programmer, so that part is for sure... John Mullan -----Original Message----- From: pic microcontroller discussion list [mailto:PICLIST@MITVMA.MIT.EDU]On Behalf Of Graham North Sent: Monday, November 08, 1999 10:06 AM To: PICLIST@MITVMA.MIT.EDU Subject: Pic programmer Importance: High Sensitivity: Confidential I am looking for a programmer that will program both 16F84's and 12C508's, that connects to The com port of a PC. It MUST connect to the com port not parrallel. Thanks for any info, GRAHAM NORTH PS If you could also tell me what software I could use with it I would be grateful.