Frankly, I have had enough with dedicated chips and have decided to get into microcontrollers, after alot of reading I have decided the 16 series of PICs would be best for my purposes, hence adding myself to this group! :) Anyways, I want to get started as cheaply as possible, but also as quickly as possible. I am wondering what you all recommend for a programmer. Electronics Now magazine has one in it's Jan 94 issue that seems OK, except I need a programmed PIC to begin programming PICs, notice the paradox! I am going to go around tomorrow asking how much it would cost to get the PIC programmed so I will probably go that way, but I figured it would be better to ask here first for your opinions. What do you recommend? I want to build it myself, mainly for cost. I would love to find a programmer out there that doesn't need a programmed chip to use. I have found one that uses the PCs parrallel port, but it is kinda old and the parts would be really hard for me to find. Thank you all for any advice in this area. TTYAL