In message <332B2306.D47@passport.ca> PICLIST@MITVMA.MIT.EDU writes: > John Dammeyer wrote: > [snippity snip] > > > > The consulting contract and terms posted by the original author shows they > > know exactly what they are doing. My guess would be that if, given the $25 > > ceiling, that the weekend/hobby contractor with 20 years experience will get > > the contract before the student does; he may even use his $1000 compiler > > and $5000 logic analyser he 'borrowed' from his real job. If the student > > quotes a lower time, due to inexperience - not incompetence, we all know > > he'll still end up spending the actual time it takes to complete the job. > > Now he's working for even less than $25/hour. Sure it's the free market > > system. To suggest that it's bad manners or inappropriate to question this, > > well, I don't think so. It works the other way round for me; the money I make doing evening and week-end contracting pays for me to buy development gear (both hardware and software) which I then use in my day job. Maybe I've got something round the wrong way here. Some years ago I worked as a contractor doing some hardware test and development work. I had a business that had gone toes-up, and at the time needed the work, badly. I went in with an hourly rate that I knew wouldn't be undercut and got the contract. I was the only hardware contractor working, but was working alongside software contractors earning 3-4 times the hourly rate I was on. After 3 months or so, a management meeting decided thath they were paying too much for contractors and would rather delay the project and do the work in house than pay out all the money. All the contractors were "released" by the end of the week except me. My contract ran for a further year and a bit with some rate rises for good measure. Sure I undersold myself, but my wife, kids, bank manager, mortgage company etc were all happy about it. There is another dimension to this too. Since the recession in the late 80's which may have hit us in Europe harder than elsewhere, we have seen a change in the nature of employment. Gone are the days of secure long-term employment. These are the days of fixed length contracts after which you leave the company and employers who think that their only responsibility is to the bottom line. The recession also had an impact on salaries, where pay freezes were common and 5% pay cuts per year happened to a number of my engineer friends, and house prices, where prices where I live fell by over 50%. With all of this, many people are turning to a portfolio of jobs rather than a single day job to spread the risks. Picking up a few contracts paying $25 an hour is very helpful to some people. If the changing face of employment means there are more people around looking for contract work, then the hourly rate is bound to come down. Enough of my ramblings. Suffice to say that I find this discussion interesting and part of the wider debate of future employment practice. Regards, Mike Watson -- My views, not my employers.