>I was serious. I bought the Picstart Plus last summer because Microchip >said it would program ALL their pic chip products. A few months later I >find I need to replace/change the firmware in the adaptor to program the >new 12C5xx parts. I think it is fair to extrapolate that when Microchip >comes out with new PIC parts, further changes will be needed to the >firmware. Or maybe there'll never be any new PIC parts? Hmmm... hadn't >though of that. Might be that with the 12C5XX being the first of a whole new series of serial programmable a basic firmware change was need to handle this. If more PIC parts follow the existing programming protocols then I doubt there will be a need to a firmware change. Some-one did say there was an older version of the P+ perhaps now you'll be ok (Until they come up with a CPU in a TO-92 pack). Rgds Mike There is no a'priori reason that the ultimate truth will be interesting or even useful, those moments of frustration during philosophical debate would be replaced by the sheer terror which accompanies true knowledge.