Point your browser to: http://oak.oakland.edu/simtel.net/msdos.html I did and entered the keyword "pads" and it came up with both programs: pads-logic(schematic capture) pads-pcb(pcb layout) and also the required library files. Please note that these free versions are not the Windows versions of their product, but they are a professional product, with gerber, postscript, plotter, and other output capabilities. It's a little dated, but it is a total package for both schematic capture and pc board. Also, this version is limited to a certain number of parts, but back before I got the real version, and had a big project to do, I would set all resistors to the same value, and it would count them all as one part, thereby getting around the limits in the PCB program. The program counts a part by the number of decals it has, so if you have a part with lots of alternate decals, you can bypass the limits by cloning the part with only the decals you actually plan to use(this trick works in the schematic capture program as well). I did a microcontroller board with it that had ram, rom, I/O, rs232 drivers, etc, and it definitely was right at the limits. Video card selection is fairly good with the free version, but you may end up using plain vga drivers :-< Give it a try. -Bob >Hi Larry, > >Where can you find the demo version? I couldn't find it on the PADs Company >Web Page. > >Thanx, > >Myke