Hi, I'm having problems programming 2 16C84 PICs but as they are the only 2 I have I have no way of knowing whether it is the programmer hardware, software or the PICs themselves. I saw a recent message mentioning PIC serial no's. Mine are 9440 CBA; would there be any reason for them to be any different from other PICs? Also is it possible to damage them by applying Vpp without Vdd present? (spot the novice) Thanks, Chris